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Complementary therapies

Any topic related to science can be discussed here.
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Alan C.
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Re: Complementary therapies

#481 Postby Alan C. » February 28th, 2012, 2:18 pm

Latest post of the previous page:

getreal
She mind reads dogs!!! Oh! And did I mention she talks to dead dogs too?
She sounds like the woman who was on Steve Wright in the afternoon a couple of months ago, I had to switch it off as I do when he has bloody "astrologers" on.
Abstinence Makes the Church Grow Fondlers.

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Alan H
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Re: Complementary therapies

#482 Postby Alan H » February 28th, 2012, 3:14 pm

Alan C. wrote:She sounds like the woman who was on Steve Wright in the afternoon a couple of months ago, I had to switch it off as I do when he has bloody "astrologers" on.
I have to switch Steve Wright off as well - from 2pm to 5pm.
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

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getreal
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Re: Complementary therapies

#483 Postby getreal » February 28th, 2012, 5:41 pm

It may well be the person she admires. She is planning on going on one of her courses (which is, of course very expensive). She has already bought her book. I don't know her name. I think she's on a "lecture tour" of the US just now. My friend fostered a couple of strays she had found for a couple of weeks. When she came to collect the dog she presented her with a copy of her book (which my friend donated to the charity shop). I don't know her name, but she's either a sharp con artist with an eye on the dollar or a thick fruit cake. But I'd plump for the first.
"It's hard to put a leash on a dog once you've put a crown on his head"-Tyrion Lannister.

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getreal
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Re: Complementary therapies

#484 Postby getreal » March 15th, 2012, 9:59 pm

Anyone seen the latest nonsense raising its ugly head?

I first heard of it on BBC 4 today. They basically rubbished it and had a haematoligist/pathologist on. It was on You & Yours and is available to listen on the website.
"It's hard to put a leash on a dog once you've put a crown on his head"-Tyrion Lannister.

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Dave B
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Re: Complementary therapies

#485 Postby Dave B » March 16th, 2012, 9:45 am

From what little I know about blood tests (after 14 years of having them and asking questions) this certainly sounds like a load of crap.

The pH of the blood is a measure of its place on the acidity - alkalinity scale and relates (IIRC) to the plasma chemistry, the liquid part of the blood. I cannot see how any microscopic inspection can give that result but a little simple chemistry in a test tube will do the job.

Talk about pseudo scientific baloney!

Edit: as usual did a bit more reading one this and found some interesting stuff, including:
Blood pH is regulated to stay within the narrow range of 7.35 to 7.45, making it slightly alkaline.[8][9] Blood that has a pH below 7.35 is too acidic, whereas blood pH above 7.45 is too alkaline. Blood pH, partial pressure of oxygen (pO2), partial pressure of carbon dioxide (pCO2), and HCO3− are carefully regulated by a number of homeostatic mechanisms, which exert their influence principally through the respiratory system and the urinary system in order to control the acid-base balance and respiration. An arterial blood gas will measure these. Plasma also circulates hormones transmitting their messages to various tissues. The list of normal reference ranges for various blood electrolytes is extensive.

Bones are especially affected by blood pH as they tend to be used as a mineral source for pH buffering. Consuming a high ratio of animal protein to vegetable protein is implicated in bone loss in women.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood

Also: a quick calculation indicates that at 20,000X magnification a single red blood cell would have an effective diameter of 120mm or more. Not sure what they can tell from that.
"Look forward; yesterday was a lesson, if you did not learn from it you wasted it."
Me, 2015

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Alan H
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Re: Complementary therapies

#486 Postby Alan H » March 16th, 2012, 10:41 am

getreal wrote:Anyone seen the latest nonsense raising its ugly head?

I first heard of it on BBC 4 today. They basically rubbished it and had a haematoligist/pathologist on. It was on You & Yours and is available to listen on the website.
This was prompted by a friend who had been in contact with a few journalists. One from You and Yours contacted her and she was interviewed. Unfortunately, it didn't make the final version, but she's the one who complained to the ASA about Errol Denton - see her blog: http://josephinejones.wordpress.com/tag/errol-denton/
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

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getreal
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Re: Complementary therapies

#487 Postby getreal » March 16th, 2012, 4:53 pm

What a load of absolute shite! There's been lots of crap around about the "benefits" of chlorophyll for a while now. What is needed is more education of the general public and let's start in schools. Ben Goldachre's book ought ot be compulsory reading in first year science. Which gets me on to another, but very related question.

Can any of you English people tell me how it is possible, in England, to teach science without a science degree? :shrug:
"It's hard to put a leash on a dog once you've put a crown on his head"-Tyrion Lannister.

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Dave B
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Re: Complementary therapies

#488 Postby Dave B » March 16th, 2012, 5:08 pm

I am not sure that it needs a science degree to put over basic science to the syllabus, but it does require the sort of mind that can cope with the concepts and the maths. Whilst looking for a book on GCSE maths I looked through the science one and, though I have no degree, almost all of the stuff was well within my ability to cope with. What was not would not have been hard to mug up on.

I believe that the skills needed by the teacher are the ability to hold the attention of kids and to be able to present the subject in an interesting way. Then he or she really needs a bit of enthusiasm for both the job and the subject, that can be the bugger factor!

I have met excellent degree holding chemists and physicists during my career but very few of those could pass their knowledge on unless you already had knowledge of their discipline.

Is it mandatory that Scottish teachers have a degree in the subject they teach, getreal?
"Look forward; yesterday was a lesson, if you did not learn from it you wasted it."
Me, 2015

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getreal
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Re: Complementary therapies

#489 Postby getreal » March 16th, 2012, 5:17 pm

Yes, it is Dave. That's why I can't get my brain around teaching Higher Level (or Advanced Level) science without one. Obviously to teach here, you must also do a year long post grad teaching qualification.

I beleive Canada operates a system similar to that in England, you get a "general" teaching qualification for secondary schools and, in theory, can teach any subject. How would that work for modern languages? Or ancient ones?

I don't agree that you don't need a degree in the subject you teach.
"It's hard to put a leash on a dog once you've put a crown on his head"-Tyrion Lannister.

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Alan H
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Re: Complementary therapies

#490 Postby Alan H » March 20th, 2012, 10:28 pm

Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

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Nick
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Re: Complementary therapies

#491 Postby Nick » March 21st, 2012, 9:53 pm

Well done, Alan! Another nail driven in!

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Alan H
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Re: Complementary therapies

#492 Postby Alan H » March 22nd, 2012, 1:09 am

It may not be over yet...hopefully more tomorrow...
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

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getreal
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Joined: November 20th, 2008, 5:40 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#493 Postby getreal » March 22nd, 2012, 8:24 pm

Great work, Alan. I didn't know the specific piece of legislation which appled to cancer treatments. Now I do.
"It's hard to put a leash on a dog once you've put a crown on his head"-Tyrion Lannister.

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Alan H
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Re: Complementary therapies

#494 Postby Alan H » March 22nd, 2012, 10:52 pm

If you weren't able to listen to the interview by David Parsley, Chairman of Totnes FM, of Dr Stephen Hopwood live, you missed an awesome pwning!

Listen again here: http://www.totnesfm.co.uk/ Click on 'Listen again' in the right-hand column and select 'The News Hour'.
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

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Alan H
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Joined: July 3rd, 2007, 10:26 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#495 Postby Alan H » March 24th, 2012, 12:16 pm

Still nothing directly from TS, but this has just been published by TotnesFM (my emphasis):

OFFICIAL: Hopwood's cancer conference is illegal

EXCLUSIVE

TODAY’S CANCER conference in Totnes has been ruled illegal by Devon Trading Standards, but organiser Dr Stephen Hopwood is still going ahead with a "private event" at a new venue.

The latest twist in the Totnes cancer controversy has also led to Dr Hopwood’s cancer clinic being ruled an illegal operation due to its promotion of treatments and cures for cancer.

Devon Trading Standards have told Dr Hopwood the Totnes Cancer Health Care Conference and his cancer clinic are in breach of the 1939 Cancer Act, which bans the advertising, by any organisation, of treatments or cures for cancer.

Trading Standards told Dr Hopwood: “Even the title of the conference and the title of your clinic, in our view, are likely to breach the legislation because of their promotion of cancer treatment."

In an attempt to remain within the law, Dr Hopwood has now changed the event from a “conference” to a “private conversation” for invited guests. However, yesterday he was taking delegate bookings from members of the public wishing to attend..

Dr Hopwood told Totnes FM: "It is no longer an event. The event is cancelled. A few people are sitting together in a private dwelling to enter into conversation that's all."

Earlier this week, complaints about the conference were made to Trading Standards by several concerned individuals. Local MP, Dr Sarah Wollaston, who had been contacted by constituents, led the campaign against the conference.

As a result of a request from Trading Standards, Totnes Town Council withdrew permission for the Civic Hall to be used as a venue, but Dr Hopwood quickly arranged an alternative venue at Eden Rise, just outside Totnes.

Devon Trading Standards have told Dr Hopwood the Totnes Cancer Health Care Conference and his cancer clinic are in breach of the 1939 Cancer Act, which bans the advertising, by any organisation, of treatments or cures for cancer.

Trading Standards told Dr Hopwood: “Even the title of the conference and the title of your clinic, in our view, are likely to breach the legislation because of their promotion of cancer treatment."

In an attempt to remain within the law, Dr Hopwood has now changed the event from a “conference” to a “private conversation” for invited guests. However, yesterday he was taking delegate bookings from members of the public wishing to attend..

Dr Hopwood told Totnes FM: "It is no longer an event. The event is cancelled. A few people are sitting together in a private dwelling to enter into conversation that's all."

Earlier this week, complaints about the conference were made to Trading Standards by several concerned individuals. Local MP, Dr Sarah Wollaston, who had been contacted by constituents, led the campaign against the conference.

As a result of a request from Trading Standards, Totnes Town Council withdrew permission for the Civic Hall to be used as a venue, but Dr Hopwood quickly arranged an alternative venue at Eden Rise, just outside Totnes.


Not sure if they actually have any new information from TS.
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

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Alan H
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Joined: July 3rd, 2007, 10:26 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#496 Postby Alan H » April 1st, 2012, 12:53 pm

Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

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Fia
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Re: Complementary therapies

#497 Postby Fia » April 2nd, 2012, 1:23 pm

:pointlaugh: Excellent Alan, thanks for that.

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getreal
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Re: Complementary therapies

#498 Postby getreal » April 2nd, 2012, 1:57 pm



Superb!!
"It's hard to put a leash on a dog once you've put a crown on his head"-Tyrion Lannister.

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Dave B
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Re: Complementary therapies

#499 Postby Dave B » April 2nd, 2012, 2:22 pm

Superb! x2 :laughter:

Would not the homoeopathic remedies for fire be specific? Should we not keep high dilutions of petrol, cooking oil, alcohol etc. handy just in case, or is sodium a cure-all?
"Look forward; yesterday was a lesson, if you did not learn from it you wasted it."
Me, 2015

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Alan H
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Re: Complementary therapies

#500 Postby Alan H » April 13th, 2012, 10:14 am

Scots herbal remedy store faces closure over new EU laws

Much of the reporting on this is the usual half-truths and speculation, but Napiers is a large concern with their main shop in the heart of student land in Edinburgh.

The report blames the closure in the EU Directive that came into force in 2005, but it's not clear if that really is the reason:
But new rules mean traders now have to pay thousands of pounds for a licence to make each product, while many products will only be available with a prescription.

It's true that manufactured herbal products like some of those Napiers sell need to be registered and that it costs money, but the costs start at a few hundred pounds and provide only basic protection to the consumer against safety of manufacture and 'quality', but there are no requirements for efficacy (in fact, if there is known efficacy, then a product isn't eligible for registration under the THRS).

On the whole, good news for the protection of the public from misleading claims.
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

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getreal
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Joined: November 20th, 2008, 5:40 pm

Re: Complementary therapies

#501 Postby getreal » April 13th, 2012, 7:55 pm

I thought there were legal requirements on the safety of herbal medicines and am appalled to discover were not. Some herbal medicines do seem to have a good evidence base behind them (evening primrose oil and benign mastalgia and St John's wort for depression) and should have to comply the same with safety regulations and requirements as real medicine. As far as I am aware, Napiers don't sell homeopathic potions, only herbal ones. I have purchased their starflower cream in the past as it seemed to help (who really knows?) my daughter's excema. It smells nice too. I would say at least it's better than steroid cream, but then, I have no idea what it contains, do I? Could contain 1% hydrocortosone for all I know.


What I don't understand about the advocates of herbal treatments is why they don't just isolate the good stuff from the plant, get rid of the nasty stuff, measure the remaining active ingredient and then sell it....Oh, wait, that's proper medicine, isn't it?

I prefer my digoxin in carefully calibrated doses courtesy of the lab and my Foxgloves to be left to grow in the garden.
"It's hard to put a leash on a dog once you've put a crown on his head"-Tyrion Lannister.


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