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Veganism

Enter here to explore ethical issues and discuss the meaning and source of morality.
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Maria Mac
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Veganism

#1 Postby Maria Mac » August 5th, 2015, 10:10 pm

Split off and moved from a topic in the vegetarian forum in case anyone is interested.

I'm not thinking of going vegan or even vegetarian at the moment but I'd like to bookmark this article here just in case.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/foodanddrink ... vegan.html

And this one, which I haven't read:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/womens ... -life.html

Maria Mac
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Re: Veganism

#2 Postby Maria Mac » March 16th, 2016, 1:38 pm

Today's article: Veganism Makes No Sense

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Dave B
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Re: Veganism

#3 Postby Dave B » March 16th, 2016, 2:31 pm

So, nothing but gathering nature's unexploited (vegetarian) bounty really fits the moral and ethical needs then?

Oh, hang on, if I eat that wild growing seed or fruit I may be depriving some poor creature of a meal! I should let the apple fall to the ground, rot and provde food and nutrients for wasps, maggots, beetles . . .

Think I'll just lay down and die so the flies and all the others can feed of me. Yes, that seems the ethical thing.

Oh, but some creatures prey on others, that is not nice, perhaps I should . . .

Hello, who are you? Thar's a nice white coat you are wearing.
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Manuel
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Re: Veganism

#4 Postby Manuel » March 18th, 2016, 10:27 am

Athena wrote:Today's article: Veganism Makes No Sense

I thought this was an interesting read ^.

I find humans' attitude to animals interesting, and I'm sure we do place different values on different species, perhaps subconsciously. If we all agree that different animals have different 'values', perhaps we would be able to define what those values are, in terms of one species to another, or in comparison to humans. Would there be any point in this? Seems barbaric but might be an interesting exercise and might be helpful if we accept that whever we eat has an animal cost to some degree.

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Tetenterre
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Re: Veganism

#5 Postby Tetenterre » March 18th, 2016, 11:13 am

The one that used to really rattle my aspie cage was the Body Shop, which claimed not to sell stuff that had been tested on animals. Strictly speaking, true, but:
* Ingredients in stuff they sold may well have been animal-tested in the past.
* They sold (still sell?) sponges, i.e. the remains of animals killed for the purpose.
Steve

Quantum Theory: The branch of science with which people who know absolutely sod all about quantum theory can explain anything.

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Re: Veganism

#6 Postby Maria Mac » April 19th, 2016, 9:07 pm


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jaywhat
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Re: Veganism

#7 Postby jaywhat » April 20th, 2016, 7:16 am

should we eat humans?

would save a lot of waste

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Dave B
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Re: Veganism

#8 Postby Dave B » April 20th, 2016, 10:13 am

I admit to not reading the article, I have seen several such arguments in the past.

Several problems comes to mind, the first being the "density" of nutrition, especially protein, per kilo of "ready to eat" food. This seems to indicate that the need for high-protein-yield crops would mean vast areas of monoculture, not the healthiest of environments.

Short of the extensive use of genetic engineering and/or chemical measures there could also be problems of water supply, pests and diseases. Mechanical harvesting means would be essential or a fair part of the crop might be consumed by the millions of fieldworkers required. Then comes the problem of fast bulk trsnsport and/or storage to deliver still edible foodstuff. Or the energy (including investment in akternative energy) involved in processing the food into a form more easily stored or transported. Cooking would still be needed, unless we are to live entirely on fruit, seeds, nuts and leaves etc that are edible raw.

And all this, possibly, before you even think of importing from beyond our own shores.

India is very reliant on non-animal foods, farming there is a matter of a great deal of either industrialisation or hardship.
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Alan H
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Re: Veganism

#9 Postby Alan H » April 23rd, 2016, 11:53 pm

Seen on Facebook:

2016-04-23_23h52_37.png
2016-04-23_23h52_37.png (864.73 KiB) Viewed 5845 times
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

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Dave B
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Re: Veganism

#10 Postby Dave B » April 24th, 2016, 9:02 am

:pointlaugh:
"Look forward; yesterday was a lesson, if you did not learn from it you wasted it."
Me, 2015

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Alan H
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Re: Veganism

#11 Postby Alan H » April 27th, 2016, 11:27 pm

Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

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gentle_dissident
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Re: Veganism

#12 Postby gentle_dissident » May 21st, 2016, 6:49 pm

I'm a vegetarian because vegans are weird. Seriously, vegans make amazing animal byproduct substitutes. It's a bit time consuming or expensive for me at the moment. I'm sure I'll be a vegan someday. I'll still wear leather. Betsy has to keel over dead someday.

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gentle_dissident
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Re: Veganism

#13 Postby gentle_dissident » May 21st, 2016, 6:54 pm

Dave B wrote:Several problems comes to mind, the first being the "density" of nutrition, especially protein, per kilo of "ready to eat" food. This seems to indicate that the need for high-protein-yield crops would mean vast areas of monoculture, not the healthiest of environments.


Beans are dead easy to grow on the patio.

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Alan H
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Re: Veganism

#14 Postby Alan H » May 21st, 2016, 6:57 pm

gentle_dissident wrote:I'm a vegetarian because vegans are weird. Seriously, vegans make amazing animal byproduct substitutes. It's a bit time consuming or expensive for me at the moment. I'm sure I'll be a vegan someday. I'll still wear leather. Betsy has to keel over dead someday.
I think I would probably liked to have been vegan, but it's too much like hard work!
Alan Henness

There are three fundamental questions for anyone advocating Brexit:

1. What, precisely, are the significant and tangible benefits of leaving the EU?
2. What damage to the UK and its citizens is an acceptable price to pay for those benefits?
3. Which ruling of the ECJ is most persuasive of the need to leave its jurisdiction?

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Dave B
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Re: Veganism

#15 Postby Dave B » May 21st, 2016, 7:07 pm

gentle_dissident wrote:
Dave B wrote:Several problems comes to mind, the first being the "density" of nutrition, especially protein, per kilo of "ready to eat" food. This seems to indicate that the need for high-protein-yield crops would mean vast areas of monoculture, not the healthiest of environments.


Beans are dead easy to grow on the patio.
Beans, IMHO, would be bloody boring if it was one's major source of protein (and smelly!) I suffer from frequent attacks of IBS and pulses have to be an infrequent treat or I dare not go out into the world :sad2: Red meat is an antidote for me! Or kaolin by the cupful, or codeine.
"Look forward; yesterday was a lesson, if you did not learn from it you wasted it."
Me, 2015

Stark
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Re: Veganism

#16 Postby Stark » May 23rd, 2016, 3:26 pm

Considering how much suffering modern farming causes to animals, and given that as Humanists we realise little separates us from the animal world, I think veganism is a topic we should all take seriously. That's not to mention the other issues around factory farming of animals such as antibiotic resistance, food security and greenhouse gas production.

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gentle_dissident
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Re: Veganism

#17 Postby gentle_dissident » May 25th, 2016, 5:47 am

Stark wrote:Considering how much suffering modern farming causes to animals, and given that as Humanists we realise little separates us from the animal world, I think veganism is a topic we should all take seriously. That's not to mention the other issues around factory farming of animals such as antibiotic resistance, food security and greenhouse gas production.

For the record, I totally agree this this poster. I'd feel kind of weird feeling up a goat friend's tits.


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